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Sternkaktus

Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyTue Apr 14, 2015 7:32 pm

Anyone got an opinion on this cactus please?
How would you classify it?
Thank you everyone.

ID?  Is this variegated? Aa_sup11
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SneakyCuttlefish
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyTue Apr 14, 2015 10:22 pm

Astrophytum asterias f. aurea perhaps...? Is there any green on it at all or is it completely yellow on all sides?

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Sternkaktus

Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyTue Apr 14, 2015 10:52 pm

No, pretty much the same all over.
Here from a different angle.

ID?  Is this variegated? Aa_sup12
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Hanazono
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyWed Apr 15, 2015 8:29 am

It is called "Akebono-han", means twilight-variegation.
It comes from the hybridization stress and not true variegation.

I think the father is super kabuto and the mother is an asterias who is mixed anther Astrophytum's gene.
I am not sure the size of the plant on the photo.
Akebono-han will have relatively short life and is hard to make flowers.
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http://frank-southofaridland.blogspot.com/
Sternkaktus

Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyWed Apr 15, 2015 10:36 pm

Very interesting!
Thank you Hanazono and thank you SneakyCuttlefish.
The plant is in a 70mm pot.
Hanazono do you have any documentation about Astro genetics?
Why do you guess that the father was the super kabuto?
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Hanazono
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 5:44 am

The asterias on the photo should be a flowering size if it was a normal form.
I do not have good information about Astrophytum written in English but you may have a look
this site: http://www.shaboten.com/astro.html

A true asterias does not accept any other Astrophytum's pollen.
This means the true astrias can not be a mother of Astrophytum hybrid.
It is possible to be a father.
An asterias related hybrid should be made by asterias' father.

Your plant shows the character of super kabuto.
The cactus appearance is similar to father, not mother normally.
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http://frank-southofaridland.blogspot.com/
Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 11:00 am


Thank you so much for sharing this information!
That is really interesting!!!
I suppose the literature you'd have is Japanese?
My partner can read Japanese. I don't know if good enough but I'd be happy to dry him :-)
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SneakyCuttlefish
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 11:25 am

Well there you go!!!! I guess I have been wasting my time trying to put A. Capricorne pollen on my Asterias. Hanazono you are a real wealth of information. You should think about writing a book.

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Sternkaktus

Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 11:41 am

Agreed!!!

Hanzono : Have you got a web page?  If not a book that would be a good spot too - or simply here.

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Hanazono
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 2:36 pm

It may not be the subject in this thread but there is an other rule for making an Astrophytum hybrid.
SneakCuttlefish tries to make capricorne x asterias (mother x father). This is also out of the rule.
The key is the flower color.
The flower of capricorne is yellow and one of asterias is yellow petals and orange throat.
This combination can make seeds but many seedlings will be Akebono-han.
If you could use capricorne v senile as the mother, you can make good hybrid seedlings because both senile and asterias flowers are same color.
The photo is my 1st filial senile x super kabuto, yellow petals and orange throat combination.
ID?  Is this variegated? Box-s-xos677pzbgareyol3wk3lnrroi-1001?uid=354fab79-9d0e-4077-9662-a2d82076cb60&etag=f7c3480e1429156037269083
The next photo is yellow flowers combination, ornatum v nudum x myriostigma cv Onzuka.
Since the hybrid of ornatum x myriostigma is called "banjyaku", this cactus is 1st filial Onzuka banjyaku.
ID?  Is this variegated? Box-s-xos677pzbgareyol3wk3lnrroi-1001?uid=c9c2b229-01a3-4e3e-ab36-2f02409438dc&etag=12029fbc1429156044504466
2nd filial shows more distinct appearance.
The photo is the combination of yellow petals and orange throat, (coahuilense x super kabuto) x super kabuto.
ID?  Is this variegated? Box-s-xos677pzbgareyol3wk3lnrroi-1001?uid=8183a690-a1a0-458a-9e46-85cce67a272b&etag=5dc27c611429156047254438
I think A. caput-medusae is not an actual Astrophytum. When you tried to make a hybrid, it sows completely different result.

I have my blog. It is just cactus flower diary. There are no description of cactus propagation.
http://frank-southofaridland.blogspot.com.au/
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Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 7:54 pm

Hanazono, as you speak of the importance of the flower colors. I want to combine super kabuto red flower x Hanzono and super kabuto red flower x super kabuto. Are there also rules on who needs to be the father and who needs to be the mother?
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Hanazono
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 8:50 pm

G'evening Sternkaktus

All of them are asterias and can be mother plants.
I recommend you to try alternative crossing.
1. red flowering super kabuto x hanazono kabuto
2. hanazono kabuto x red flowering super kabuto

I am not sure your target but:
3. red flowering super kabuto x super kabuto
4. super kabuto x red flowering super kabuto

You will get 4 types of seeds.

I sowed seeds of red flowering asterias x hanazono kabuto and hanazono kabuto x red flowering asterias, 2 types in this season.
The target is a red flowering hanazono kabuto.
I grafted young seedlings on Pereskiopsis, 12 each.
Unfortunately a half of red flowering asterias x hanazono kabuto have turned to monstrose.

Hanazono
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Sternkaktus

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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyThu Apr 16, 2015 9:25 pm

I am after red flowers :-)
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Hanazono
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyFri Apr 17, 2015 9:05 am

I think the flower color of cactus also will follow Mendel's Theories basically.

Many people tried to make red flowering asteias but many of them were reddish color which is the 1st filial of Mendel's Theories.

You have a red flowering super kabuto.
I am not sure it is a true red or reddish.
A true red flower has also red color stigma.
Since true red flower asterias is abnormal and may not be a mother.
Abnormal stigma can not make seeds normally.

A true red flowering aserias can be a father.

I still recommend you to try 4 types crossing described before.

You can not expect so much on 1st filial but yes on 2nd filial.
(Reddish flowering asterias x true red flowering asterias) will make many true red flowering asterias.

I will attach both photos, true red and reddish for your reference.
2nd filial true red
ID?  Is this variegated? Box-s-xos677pzbgareyol3wk3lnrroi-1001?uid=ae9af87a-5555-4546-9c9d-faf810cf89f3&etag=b683dc601429224691194979

Reddish one
ID?  Is this variegated? Box-s-xos677pzbgareyol3wk3lnrroi-1001?uid=c26ef463-35ef-4613-9797-962f38abd9db&etag=9d4432021413091394326427
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Sternkaktus

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ID?  Is this variegated? Empty
PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptyFri Apr 17, 2015 11:49 am

This is incredible good information!  
I thank you so much! It is very kind of you to share this.  
Mine have yellow stigma. So they shall be mums :-)  and I shall try to find red stigma ones who can become a dad.
I love genetics :-)
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SneakyCuttlefish
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PostSubject: Re: ID? Is this variegated?   ID?  Is this variegated? EmptySat May 02, 2015 7:54 am

So i took your helpful information hanazono and I reversed what I was doing. I crossed asterias pollen onto my capricorne cv major. Success!! I have a fruit.

ID?  Is this variegated? Img_1713

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